New trailer on gametrailers

[KowtowRobinson]

Originally posted by Sacharja
On one of the newer screenshots Sieg is seen in the recovery animation of something that looks awfully similar to Strifes 6B.

Well I guess we know who Serge is gonna use then.

Strife of America, son!

[Sacharja]

He was tops in the japanese tier list.
Upper mid with 2G on the regular one I think. 3rd or 2nd worst without 2G.
X, Mitsu and Taki should make you sweat in SC2, too, given theres no distinct advantage SC2 Night has over SC3 Sieg in terms of anti-pressure. Sophie raped him just as hard back then as today with her deadly stab of doom. And still... relative to the rest of the cast SC3 Sieg has a higher tier position, as the overall cast is weaker, not stronger.
You have some points on his design/balance flaws. Although 2_8B+K does evade well and his mix-up game is everything but half-assed with 3 50/50's that are all extremely hard to block on reaction and offer great reward (albeit with a fair amount of risk, but thats nothing new to his gameplan). All in all I see his different incarnations share the same problems.
SC3 Sieg is not - by any means - a good character, far from it. But yeah, youre still underestimating the hell out of him and overestimate SC2 Night at the same time.
That has nothing to do with being a "scrub" or worse player, though. I knew this stuff back when I couldnt break throws for shit and Adamas used to wipe the floor with me.
Go play some SE. For real. SC1_2_3 Sieg/Nightmare seem like Rock compared to the monster that is SE Sieg.

[JAG THE GEMINI]

Originally posted by Sacharja
Thats SC3 Nightmare 22A (which is teh suxx), not SC2 Nightmare 22A (which is teh awsum). So dont get your hopes up.
On one of the newer screenshots Sieg is seen in the recovery animation of something that looks awfully similar to Strifes 6B. A welcome addition, if it turns out to be that move.

No, it is definitely 22/88AA from SCII. At least it´s the animation of SCII 88A. In SCIII, Nightmare had only 22/88Ab. Which was hella unsafe and he didn´t evade during the second strike.

Here is hope that Nightmare will be a strong Char in SCIV imo.

[Sacharja]

Watched it a few more times.
Seems youre right. My bad.
The scene starts mid-way during the execution of the first strike, thats why its barely noticeable. Its strange that it whiffs from that distance, though. Maybe they nerfed its range?

[Lone Knight]

He had 22_88A series for keep away (pretty useless against X, I know...), 66K[b] (guaranteed on CH?) /K (pushout MAX!) /8WR A+K (fear the grounding low!) for close range, and I think his throw range was just as good as now. 2g also didn't fuck GI up as much as VC (at least a throw was guaranteed off of it), so it was a more viable tool to escape pressure.

His main 50/50, the dreaded "will I get kicked in the shin or stabbed in the guts?"... honestly, while the kick is hard to see on reaction, I can consistently block the stab (so can my brother who is pretty much my only opponent atm, much to my dismay...). Even if the stab hits, I think thats the option with lesser dmg. And since its a stance move, generic 2A still shuts it down. Err... I have to admit I didn't play for so long I can't even remember much of his other mixups. WR[b] /flapjack with some WR K mixed in? I actually liked that, if only

Does 2_8B+K evade better than 22_88B+K in SC2? I must admit, I never really got into that move as an evader, but it didn't seem to be that good. I assumed it was an "updated" version without having the choice of canceling it into some move that looks like b6 (the notation was 22_88 B+K3B if I remember correctly), and ends in a different stance. He didn't need it in SC2 since his other 8WR moves were so much better...

And being a scrub has a lot to do with it, since scrubs play other scrubs... hmm... maybe I'm a scrub because I only play scrubs would be a better way of putting it. My Nightmare never got beaten and I wasn't even playing good. And then, BANG, SC3 comes and I don't just have to work for my wins, I have to sweat for them. I mean I still usually won in the end (my win-lose ratio got considerably worse ofc), but I was forced to play a lot more cautious/defensive, and I don't think I like that :P

[JAG THE GEMINI]

Originally posted by Sacharja
Watched it a few more times.
Seems youre right. My bad.
The scene starts mid-way during the execution of the first strike, thats why its barely noticeable. Its strange that it whiffs from that distance, though. Maybe they nerfed its range?

Right, you can´t see the animation right from the start.

As an old SCII-Nightmare "Fan", i noticed that move during the first watch of the trailer, and got exited.

[KrayzieCD]

Originally posted by Sacharja
In the end its all about adaption (or choosing the right secondaries ).

Once again you are correct!

For me once fails me, comes to the rescue!

[Sacharja]

@Lone Knight

Of those tools only K and 66KB are meant for anti-pressure. I see no noticeable difference between SC2 and SC3 K. 66KB was waaay better by itself than in SC3, but that advantage was negated due to the nature of SC2's system.
Also... I dont really take bugs into account here, otherwise the whole discussion would be pointless - G2 Nighty = abuuuuuse.
SRSH K_B is not his main mix-up. Throws and Flapjack_WS [b] are. And no, his throwrange wasnt even remotely that good in SC2. I can grab people after a close-to-midrange hit with B6 in this game.
About 22_88B+K, I cant say for sure. The step system differs a lot. All I can tell you is that there was no point to 22_88B+K because of the strong step and no ch against steppers. 2_8B+K in SC3 at least fills a niche.

@Krazyie

Ah, yeah. I noticed you havent been using Maxi at all lately, though.

PS: I was going to ask if you had MSN but your PM box is full.

[JAG THE GEMINI]

Originally posted by KrayzieCD
Once again you are correct!

For me once fails me, comes to the rescue!

I stopped playing SCIII some time ago ´cause of the Maxi-incarnation... Only one of many reasons.

Bring SCII Maxi back Namco! My sleeples nights only fighting with him would be nearly endless!

[Lone Knight]

@Sacharja

I meant 66KK and 66K -> buffered 8WR A+K. His 6K pushed everyone out of his face in general, so I could've mentioned that too. On a side note, I find it kind of lol that he gained throw range while loosing his large/long demon claw arm thing, but w/e its not like story ever had that much impact on balance. I really didn't notice it was that long... once my PS2 is back from repairs, I think I'll have to do an SC3 session :P

And now talking about this made me want to play SC even more. If the online will be good... god, I can already feel all the time I'll waste in front of the TV screen.

[Sacharja]

But 6K is teh suxx.
Yeah his throwrange doesnt make sense, but it seems they just copied certain properties for Siegs and Nights basic design (step, size of hitbox etc etc).

I personally will be wasting much more time in training mode. But online will be fun, too, I guess.
Does Vader have to force choke a bitch? Yes, yes indeed he does.

[~in3vitableTIMNG~]

it could be sigfrieds dad its a long shot i know but he has a scar could be from a fatal blow he wants to redeem lost power could be soul edge and move set wise it could be as monstrous as night terror and they did say its about sigfrieds roots and his clash with nightmare, so it could be a thought

[Tanegashima]

Actually Sigurds dad is just some knight with a moustache (he was in Sigurds SC ending).

It was a cool trailer. The game looks downright sexy and it gave us more of a glimpse of the armour break and some instant kills. I do wish though it showed that new GI too. But now we can speculate on who the new guy is. My guess is he is the evil prince so I agree with Windstar on this.

[Ceron]

Originally posted by KrayzieCD
Well said Sacharja......I've been reading through various forums with SC4 topics and all i've seen people do is bitch how they changed Voldo so much, they changed Ivy so much, they changed Nightmare (Siegfried) so much. So you can't play the new game exactly like you played the old one......boo fucking hoo! Go learn some new strats, new combos and quit crying....everyone wants everything to be so easy. I can't lie, I bitched at the very beginning of SC3 of how different Maxi was and that I hated his SC3 version compared to the SC2 version but I got over it eventually and learned some new shit. All the people from SC2 that used Ivy and her braindead easy shit whined when 33A didn't lead to half life anymore, they changed her stances etc. and all dropped her and the game. No more than a month later you had people like Linkrkc and Ivylicious coming up with so much new shit for her that they made the complainers look like skill lacking idiots. You got people like Manta amazing everyone with the crazy stuff that Voldo has now.

And by you not mentioning SC3 Talim is proof the bitch is recognizable trash (or just not as fun as SC2 Talim)? That shit made me pick up X.

[lolo]

I leave some captures of the video.

http://www.tzarsectus.com/sc4-grabs/new/

[Ghengis John]

Is it just me or does the new guy bear an uncanny resemblance to Clancy Brown? Humor me here and compare.

First, The new guy:
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p.../soulander.jpg

Now, Clancy Brown as he appears today:
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...ancy_brown.jpg
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...hn/2152480.jpg

Now, Clancy in the 1980's as The Kurgan. Highlander's villian who I'm sure Namco is well aware of. Note the armor, tufts of fur where feathers now go and a similar skeletal/muscular appearance:
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p..._John/acb3.jpg

Besides that, Crazy said what I was gonna say about cf's and camera angle. Nice trailer, downloaded.

[Dreamkiller]

OMG! lol.

If Kowtow lost weight, that is EXACTLY wat he would look like.
LOL.
<3

[Arslaan]

Originally posted by Ghengis John
Is it just me or does the new guy bear an uncanny resemblance to Clancy Brown? Humor me here and compare.

First, The new guy:
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p.../soulander.jpg

Now, Clancy Brown as he appears today:
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...ancy_brown.jpg
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...hn/2152480.jpg

Now, Clancy in the 1980's as The Kurgan. Highlander's villian who I'm sure Namco is well aware of. Note the armor, tufts of fur where feathers now go and a similar skeletal/muscular appearance:
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p..._John/acb3.jpg

Besides that, Crazy said what I was gonna say about cf's and camera angle. Nice trailer, downloaded.

hmm...the first person that came to mind for me when I looked at that image of the "new guy" was Olcadan (human form). His eyebrows look very similair, and he seems to have some form of bird as his shoulder guard thing...also the length of his finger nails make them look more like bird claws.

[Sacharja]

Originally posted by Ghengis John
I likez me sum Clancy Brown.

Dude!
Someone totally made the same comparison on ger-calibur.de!

You know what that means...

[KowtowRobinson]

Originally posted by Dreamkiller
OMG! lol.

If Kowtow lost weight, that is EXACTLY wat he would look like.
LOL.
<3

You mean if I lost weight and aged 30 years at the same time? I dunno, maybe.

[Ghengis John]

Originally posted by Sacharja
Dude!
Someone totally made the same comparison on ger-calibur.de!

You know what that means...

God I suddenly wish I could speak German so my newly discovered Prussian soul brother and I could begin to collaborate on how best to bring this before the public. The people must know! Did anyone make it to the bottom pic or just see the age difference and bail?

Arslaan, something about the look of this guy tells me he's not going to be as friendly as olcadon.

[peanuts555]

SUDDENLY I WANTS TO PLAY AS KILIK AND BEAT PEOPLE DOWN WITH HIS GLOWY STICK! btw is that armor comming off thing actually part of the game?

[lolo]

I agree that the kilik´s finisher is really cool... but it´s just 9B with special effects...
And yes, the breakeable armor it´s part of the game, we still don´t know how easy will be to do, but it´s an important part of the game, it gives the chance to end up a match.

[Tiamat]

Originally posted by Sacharja
Strifes 6B

is full homo

[Sacharja]

Originally posted by Tiamat
is full homo

Not when Sieg does it.